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Military Firearm Restoration Corner

Tools for stock making


littlecanoe

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I'm at a crossroad trying to determine where I want to go with stock-making.

 

I have purchased and read the book by Wesbrook. This after making two stocks with no advice or help. The other day I added an extension/repair to the tip of the forearm section on an old sporterized military stock. To my pleasant surprise, inletting that new portion was a pleasure and much simplified with my newly gained knowledge.

 

Now the hard part. I want to try to get into stock making and checkering(sp) but don't want to spend a small fortune. In the back of Wesbrook's book he gives a list of preferred tools. It's quite a list with quite a large pricetag when added up, even with the C & R discount.

 

This is why I come to the forum to ask those of you who have ventured down this road the following question. If you had to pick the basic tools to competently inlet an action and magazine/guard, what tools would you place on that list? Please consider this question in the light of getting "the most bang for your buck".

 

Thanks

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I'm a Bubba, but I'm trying to do good stock work.

 

For inletting, the things I use the most are (1) a cabinet rasp; (2) a 1/4" chisel and (3) a 3/4" chisel. Sandpaper backed by a wood block or an eraser 150, 220 and 400 grit. The dreaded Dremel tool also sees frequent action. I've made some tiny chisels out of O1 scrap. I don't think it makes much sense to buy expensive chisels - any sharp piece of hardened tool steel can be a good chisel - the important thing is to keep them sharp. The chisels need frequent stoning and stropping. I do the stropping with a piece of leather tacked to a scrap piece of 1x3, soaked with oil and 320 grit lapping compound. The last 9" of a Turkish Mauser barrel sees a lot of use wrapped with sand paper for sanding barrel channels.

 

I've tried checkering with both my own tools and with the cheap Dembart tools from Midway. I'm not good enough at it yet to comment.

 

Get a few basic tools and keep working. You'll figure-out what you need, and it will probably be different from what everyone else uses. As long as you make a stock that works for you, who can argue?

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A couple tools in addition to those suggested above that are handy yet affordable:

4-in-hand rasp. This is a 1/2 round rasp on one end and cut file on the other, about 8" long. The flip side has the same cuts but in a flat configuration.

Stanely (or any other brand) "sur-form" rasps - both flat and round. The short four inch rasp shaped like a block plane is very handy but I keep a twelve incher to. The round rasp can be used both as a rasp as well as the end being used as a scraper if the little handle thingy on the end is removed. These are popular for auto body work and can be found in auto parts stores fairly cheap. The blades are replaceable.

A set of small gouges. These can be the cheapies sold at hobby shops for about fifteen bucks since as DT said, it's the edge that counts. They usually come with a variety of shapes but the 3/16 or 1/4 "chisel" and the half-round will be the most used.

A GOOD sharpening stone (I like Norton's fine India). Keep this stone for nothing but sharpening your tools - NOT polishing receivers, etc. Keep it clean and well lubed. A can of WD-40 with the red tube on the nozzle is great as you can lube your stone AND blow the dirt out with the same blast! Wrap the stone in a slightly oily rag for storage. Also, learn to use the stone properly! Sharp cutting tools are pure pleasure, dull ones are dangerous!

A good assortment of sandpaper. Not the "fine, medium and course" flint paper but good paper with the grits marked in numbers! 60 to 400 is a good range. I like Norton's "No-fill Adalox" but its not always easy to find. Garnet paper is next best (for wood work). The finer grits will be in black colored silicon carbide (wet or dry).

Finally - several sanding blocks. These can be improvised like DT's rifle barrel and blocks of scrap wood, or you can get the fancy rubber ones. Either way get in the habit of ALWAYS backing you paper with something besides your fingers.

 

This may add up to more than you want to spend, but you needn't buy em all at once. Great deals can often be had at flea markets and discount stores. However, as with most things, good tools make good work. If you're serious about doing good work, you will have to invest in the tools.

 

As an example of how cheap tools can be used; I recently bought two sets of nice looking wooden handled screw drivers on close-out at a chain store. Of course they were six each - 3 slotted & 3 philips - of standard configuration screw drivers. I re-ground them to various hollow ground shapes and now have an impressive rack of rosewood and brass handled "turn screws." While shopping think "what I need" instead of getting bogged down by "what they have." wink.gif

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For the chisels and cutting tools, try a piece of strap iron for raw material. It works easily, will sharpen very well, and will re-sharpen even easier. It can be hammer "tuned" around a form for gouges, etc.

 

You can also get a great edge if you have a hard edge felt wheel. You can charge that up and put a great egde on with that as well.

 

The reason I recommend the strap iron is that it is cheap. If you don't end up with what you want, you have spent little time, and littler money.

 

For the gouges, look for round stones, although sand paper will start a pretty good edge.

 

A while ago I recommended learning to make and use scrapers. That hasn't changed. A dollar or couple of dollar yard sale old hand saws will make great scrapers (with practice). Also cost very little, but little time, Scrapers really open the grain for that great golden glow.

 

Oh yeah. Couple of cheap hammers, various sizes shapes weights. One plastic, one rubber, one lead, one brass. For the lead one, get a piece of pipe, drill a handle hole through the side, and melt down wheel weights and fill it with that (put the handle through first) before you start to fill it. After, grind away the pipe at the ends and you have a poorman's cheap lead hammer.

 

If you can get a fairly thick hickory (nutwood of nearly any type I'll guess), make chasing mallets from that.

 

Forstner drill bits. Most of what you will see recomemned can be found at Harbor Freight. Mostly Asian made, but not necessarilly unuseable.

 

Yard sales are a great place to find lots of this stuff. Do the estate sale run a couple times. Hand tools languish at these.

 

YMMV

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littlecanoe,

 

I was in the same boat about two years ago. With three kids and a stay at home mom, the coffers at my house aren't running over. Thus, my hobbies are on a shoe string budget.

 

This is where I have to differ a little from the previous posts. I tried the cheap chisels and even tried making my own with mixed results. If you have the time and a access to tool steel and a torch, by all means you can make your own and some good ones. My time is very limited and I had to pay for my steel. The chisels will make your work MUCH easier and look so much better. I can get my $10 chisels sharp enough to shave with, but the first time I hit a piece of wood with them it rolls the edge. I bought a 12-piece set of Frued chisels and a 6-piece set of Crown chisels. The Freuds were regular $300 and I got them for $85. The Crowns were regular $60 and I got them for $35. I find myself using the Crowns much more due to their size. The Freuds are just a little too big for tight work, but work great for hogging out areas. Both are sharp enough to cut off a hair thin piece of wood.

 

 

Crown 6-piece set

 

Freud 12-piece set

 

Keeping your tools sharp is paramount, whether it is a chisel, scraper or file. If you are sharpening your chisel after 5, 10 or even 20 strokes with it, you are using all of your time sharpening. I usually hit my chisels on the stones before I start and they are good for several hours worth of work. Buy the best that you can afford and a 6-piece set is more than enough for most of your tasks. Look on ebay for the Miller Falls set. They are a good older set to get started with.

 

I have found a great use for the cheaper chisels. I flatten the forward angle on them and then push the cutting edge into the grinder just for a second. This caused the cutting edge to look more like a screw driver, but it's edges work great for scraping. Once they start getting a little due, couple of seconds in the grinder and they are back to form. Super handy scrapers already contoured.

 

Yard sales are great for files and assorted tools. I have a Harbor Frieght close by and they have files, rasps, punches and such SUPER cheap. I don't have a band saw, so once I get the action inletted, the drawknife ($7 off ebay) takes large amounts of wood off in short order. Then the files and rasps take over. A person can't have enough files!

 

Good luck.

Kris

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Sounds like your cheap chisels weren't properly hardened. I haven't had that trouble. With the ones I've made they're easy to get glass hard with an OA torch and a jar of motor oil. Just heat the edge slowly to non-magnetic - about cherry red - and plunge into the oil. Then stone and strop.

 

As long as the chisels you buy are made from tool steel you should be able to get them just as hard as any tool out there.

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I had some oil quenched bar stock and worked on making my own. Had pretty good results. The enough metal for 6+ chisels cost me about $15 alone. If I had more time to play, I might try it again. I even made handles out of scrap Zebra wood and some fancy walnut. I'm just having too much fun using the ones I have to finish them.

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Gents,

Thanks for the fine advice. And please, bring more as the thoughts come up.

 

I'm pretty comfortable with the flat chisels. I really like the look of the barrel channel chisels. Looks like it would make quick work and give a good base to work from for keeping the channel flat. That's the one I'm not sure that I could make.

 

Have you ever worked with the barrel channelling tools that have the two wooded ball handles and multiple round scraper discs attached in row? This looks like a handy dandy tool also.

 

I'm sure that I can get by with the basic stuff that I've used. It's just so much work though. I've really found that having the right tool, on other projects, has made what might be miserable fun. Saves some skin on the knuckles too!!

 

Now, the small curled scrapers I can see making easily. I have a set of Shop Fox cabinet scrapers that are good for smoothing once a burr is burnished on the edge.

 

What creative approach can you see to making a functional tool for cutting the barrel channel? Is there something that is just sitting there under our nosed that we are overlooking?

 

 

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What creative approach can you see to making a functional tool for cutting the barrel channel?

 

A table saw with the fence set just right. I've heard of people using routers too.

 

"Recreating the American Longrifle" recommends starting the barrel channel by drilling a series of holes down the centerline and chiseling-out the web.

 

I think the important thing is to keep everything square until the inletting is done. It's easier to make sure everything is where its supposed to be when you have nice, square edges to measure from.

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I believe the barrel channeling tool mentioned was this one, made by Gunline, mine are many years old and they work fine for deepening the channel--

 

user posted image

 

fritz

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DT: I have used the tablesaw method to get the initial barrel channel started. It worked well.

I've considered the router method. I like it for bulk removal. Bulk removal is always the easiest though. I'm trying to find the poor man's way or tool for that finess work. That is, other than using a wooden dowel and various grits of sand paper.

 

Square is definitely key! Power planers and joiners and tablesaws are nice here!!

 

Fritz: That's the monster. Did you try any other tool before investing in that particular one? Do you use this tool only to deepen the channel or to finish also? By finish I refer to the process of removing those last traces of gunblack from the wood. Do you find that only one diameter in this particular cutter is what you migrate to?

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I have the same tools as the one fritz showed you for the barrel channel. Mine are in 9/16, 5/8, 11/16. 3/4, and 7/8" sizes. I paid around 18.00 for each through Brownells and they are what I use from start to finish on the barrel channel. They are very good for this and with a degree of caution can be used very accurately. Those channel inletters, assorted wood chisels and a hand rasp with changable blades are the only real tools I use in stockmaking. Otherwise it is sandpaper with a backing block and slow careful progress. If I was going to make a suggestion on what is the single most valuable tools to have, it would be the barrel channel cutters shown. swamp_thing

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Someone mentioned above the importance of keeping everything straight. The first thing I do when starting a wood carving project (and even a lot of machine work) is establish a center line. Mark this line all the way around your work piece, end to end, top, bottom and ends. All measurements will then be taken off this reference point. The line will have to be refreshed periodically as you work but it's importance cannot be overstressed.

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I made all my small scrapers and gouges from coil springs. Coil automotive valve and hood springs can be un-wound and shaped by heating with a small propane torch. After final shaping and honing, heat the cutting end red-hot and quench in water. Fit a small length of broom stick with epoxy for a handle. You can make a dozen different shapes and sizes for almost nothing.

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I have several chisels and punches my Grandpa made,and I've made a couple too,out of engine valves.They're free from any garage,and the vale end is even kinda handy being wide and flat.I belong to a family of mechanics,so there is no shortage of burned valves.I got a couple that came out of a Catepillar diesel,and it doesn't stick to a magnetic tool strip holder.Jerry

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Swampy, Do you find that you use a few of those channel tools more than others or do you use them to progressively deepen the channel?

 

Can some of you guys who have the home made tools post pics to give me a better idea. I like the idea of making my own where I can.

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200 years ago there were no mail-order tool supliers. Craftsmen had to make all their tools them selves. Some of the finest rifles, furniture, and musical instruments were made during that time with home-made tools. If it could be done then, it can be done now. I went though several tool catalogs and picked out the tools I thought I could make. Start with the small simple ones and advance to the others later. As you build a collection you can then make unique tools modified for specific tasks. It is not that hard to do. The best part of tool making is there is a lesson learned in making each one of them and when finished you will know exactly how to use the tool.

 

I have made checkering tools. They were more trouble than they were worth. Get a Dem Bart checkering set and be happy.

 

I turned the handle-making part into an experiment in stock wood staining and finishing techniques. Each of my tools is fitted with a different walnut handel with every kind of stain and finish I could get my hands on.

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Honestly, I must say that I use the two biggest ones very little, but, when opening up a channel near the chamber area, it is much harder to keep straight and true using a smaller sized channel cutter. One thing to keep in mind here is that when you are using say a 3/4 inch channel cutter, it will cut the width at 3/4 and keep the depth at 1/2 that distance, or 3/8", thus inletting the barrel to the half way point. This is the depth you want. If you use a smaller cutter to make a wider channel, then you must also try to keep the depth proper as well. I would really suggest getting them all, but if you must leave any out, then I would say skip the 11/16 and 7/8. You will wish you had them later though. swamp_thing

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"200 years ago there were no mail-order tool suppliers. Craftsmen had to make all their tools them selves. Some of the finest rifles, furniture, and musical instruments were made during that time with home-made tools.."

 

Some truly sage advice here from the Reverend! Re-read his post and set your mind free. Look in the tool boxes of experienced gunsmiths or established craftsmen of any art and you may be amazed at how few unmodified, store-bought tools you'll find.

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I agree and have many tools that I have made or refashioned myself. But, that said, not everyone has the means or the ability to make their own tools. For those, the store bought ones will come in real handy. I have seen many folks who were very good at working with wood that couldn't do anything with metal. The same goes for almost any type of work. If one can make their tools, and has the materials to do so, then they usually will end up with the best tools for the job. Not trying to take away from anyones suggestions here, as they are all good and contain invaluable information. Even in the case of the inletting tools, the handy person with some rod and a few flat washers could fabricate their own. It all boils down to the time and skills one possesses. swamp_thing

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Had to mod the name a little bit but it's still me. littlecanoe.

 

MB, I hear ya about not getting stuck in a grove there. Creativity is what it's all about anyway. I'm kinda looking for a nice mix of creative and productive. I'm definitely gonna try my hand at making some of the smaller scrapers.

 

Swampy, On the washer/cutters on the channelling tool; how is the cutting edge established. That would be an easy make with various washers as spacers and threaded rod. The only concern is the washers being hard enough to hold an edge. What grade (or can you buy graded washers) washer would it take?

Then how to sharpen? Is the cutting edge just good and square or does it have a burr burnished onto the edge?

 

It'll take a little more time but I can see the value in what I'd learn in the process.

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Why would you need to make your own barrel channel scraper tool when you can get them for $6.34 each from Brownell's?

 

But that's for the Junior model, the model like I posted the pic of (with the other wood knob) is gonna set you back $15.67. The one you make is probably not going to have the other wood knob to help you with the cut.

 

The edges of the discs are not especially sharp, but made of high carbon steel. I don't know if you can find common washers with this quality.

 

Just buy the ones already made for the purpose.

 

fritz

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OK, so, as has been pointed out you would probably want hardened washers, which can be obtained. I just looked on one fastener site and they do make them. Of course, that said, I do not know how much would be saved in cost. Also, Brownells does sell the replacement cutter sets for about half the cost of the tool itself. If one was on a tight budget, you could just buy the cutter replacements and make the rest of the tool. fritz, is the cost you quoted with a C&R license? I checked their web site and they are about $23.00 each without it. It all boils down to how much is ones time worth and what can they afford to spend, as well as how much satisfaction will be attained through making your own tools. For me, I elected to buy the complete cutters at the time of purchase. When the time comes for the next set I may well try the washer route. I have made many of my tools and it is half the fun of using them. Little_canoe, if you don't have your C%R, you may want to consider having it for the savings on supplies alone. I did have mine, but after I quit buying surplus rifles from the distributors I allowed it to expire. Miss the savings on parts and supplies though. swamp_thing

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The prices I mentioned were with the discount. The replacement cutters can be bought in all sizes after you buy the main tool.

I don't think they even made the Jr. model when I got mine, but I like the extra control with the two handles on the more expensive one.

 

fritz

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You want cheap and good? I'll give you cheap and good. Broken glass makes the best scraper you can get comes in all shapes and sizes. I have used glass scrapers for years and they work great. If your worried about cutting yourself wear leather gloves. I have never cut myself using them. (yet!) When it gets dull just break a new edge or get another piece.

 

Swamprat

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