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Military Firearm Restoration Corner

Cycling Rounds


cameleon

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I have a Spanish sporter in.243. I'm using Monarch soft points (all I could find local). If I drive the bolt home with vigor the round hits the ramp and up and over into the chamber. If I'm a little sluggish driving the bolt home sometimes the bullet nose dives and hits the outer lower part of the chamber and does not make it in. It gets hung up. More of a nuisance as most times it's ok. A problem or "if it ain't broke don't fix it". Thanks for any input.

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I have a somewhat similar problem with my 7x57 Spanish Mauser. Shorter bullets do OK, but max length ones slam against the barrel end. "The Guys" said it was likely a feed ramp thingie, although fixing it is another story. I THINK that if I add some JB weld to the sides area where the round gets fed up to the chamber, it would "steer" it better. Haven't got to that yet. Too many projects.

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Yeah, yours sounds the opposite of mine. I'm thinking the shorter .243 is not supported enough the whole way into the chamber. So if you hit it fast the front nose jumps up and clears the opening of the chamber. If you're to slow the nose drops down and gets hung up. I'll leave well enough alone. Like I said more of a nuisance. Just have to remember to be robust getting the bolt home.

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Also I'm not used to cock on close bolt. If I'm not concentrating I can get hung up with that resistance at the end of bolt travel. I think a cock on open would be better suited to cycling these short rounds. You can drive it home easier. For me the cock on close can get kinda herky jerky.

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When the bolt gets down to the cocking part, the round is well into the chamber. That doesn't bother me, as I am not really a bolt gun guy, so I don't have a lot of muscle memory of cycling a cock on open. My first gun, a bolt action 22, was cock on close too, and I think the hammer spring on that one was as strong as a Mauser, if not stronger, as cocking that took more effort. That was "a few" decades ago now.

 

Here is what Don said in regards to mine:

http://www.sporterizing.com/index.php?showtopic=11007

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The shorter .243 is not quite in the chamber as much as the original 8mm would be. It seems as the bolt is closing and the round is coming up under the extractor it will not slide up enough under the extractor if working the bolt slow. This presents a different angle into the chamber. If I am robust in chambering a round there is no problem. But as I am driving the bolt home fast I can not really see what is going on differently. I can only guess that the rim is more up the bolt face and at a better angle.

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Sorry, I ignored the fact that you were using a shorter round compared to the original cartridge that it was designed to handle. You may be right that the old extractor is not grabbing the round fully to guide it home. I rebarreled a full length Turk 98 to 22-250, but not being concerned with having follow up shots, I installed a single shot follower in the magazine and never tried feeding from the magazine. I'm a singleshot kind of guy.

I found a short follower, Mag spring and nylon spacer made to handle short rounds through full length actions for under $20, through Numrich Arms. I realize that you may not want to invest $20 in the firearm, and there is no certainty that it would solve your problem, and it's only a suggestion. You have a great day.

 

https://www.gunpartscorp.com/ad/811140.htm

 

 

Spiris

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Sorry, I ignored the fact that you were using a shorter round compared to the original cartridge that it was designed to handle. You may be right that the old extractor is not grabbing the round fully to guide it home. I rebarreled a full length Turk 98 to 22-250, but not being concerned with having follow up shots, I installed a single shot follower in the magazine and never tried feeding from the magazine. I'm a singleshot kind of guy.

I found a short follower, Mag spring and nylon spacer made to handle short rounds through full length actions for under $20, through Numrich Arms. I realize that you may not want to invest $20 in the firearm, and there is no certainty that it would solve your problem, and it's only a suggestion. You have a great day.

 

https://www.gunpartscorp.com/ad/811140.htm

 

 

Spiris

Appreciate the tips. The kit may be a good idea as it comes with a new spring which I'm thinking may be the problem. The old one may not have enough omph to push the round up all the way when the bolt is moving slower. May be working the bolt faster gives it a little more spring. Also the thicker shoulder of the 243 may also add to resistance of the round going in if the bolt is not worked smartly. This is just a fun shooter. I haven't hunted in decades and only have a public range to do a little plinking. I'm not going nuts over it. LOL.

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Also, that 243 is like a 308 necked down, right? The gun was originally built for 7x57, and the 308 is different in 2 ways, I believe plus the caliber, of course. The shoulder is in a different place and I think the wall taper is different. The changes are not a lot, but enough that you can't ream a 7x57 chamber to 7mm-08 (308 necked down to 7mm) and vice versa. Each is bigger in a different spot. That may effect the timing on the feeding.

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Also, that 243 is like a 308 necked down, right? The gun was originally built for 7x57, and the 308 is different in 2 ways, I believe plus the caliber, of course. The shoulder is in a different place and I think the wall taper is different. The changes are not a lot, but enough that you can't ream a 7x57 chamber to 7mm-08 (308 necked down to 7mm) and vice versa. Each is bigger in a different spot. That may effect the timing on the feeding.

You are right. Now I'm thinking the shoulder plays more a part in this. I was slowly cycling a round and although this time the bullet nose did not hit the outer chamber, it went in, but the shoulder was more resistant to the bolt closing. As compared to my Yugo 24/47 the longer, small shoulder 8mm just slides right in. IMHO conversions to a different caliber may have inherent characteristics that may not always be overcome. Just accommodated to.

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For what its worth. Years ago a shooting bud had a Mauser converted to 308. Using the machine shop at where he worked he modified the mag follower to give a lift to the front of the cartridge. Best I recall he somehow attached a piece of sheet metal to the top of the follower with a spacer underneath the front. Worked fine until the last round. The bolt went over the top of the cartridge's rim and wouldn't pick it up. He'd stick his finger in there giving the last round a slight shove forward before the bolt would make contact.

 

The Savage rifle I converted to 458 from 300 Winnie just the opposite. If I move the bolt briskly it sometimes goes over the top of the cartridge. If I move the bolt slowly it engages the cartridge head pushing it forward. I need to work on the rails but lacking the skills and patience am hesitant to do it myself. Years ago friend and I botched up a Mauser sporting project by taking to much off the rails. Once its filed away there's no putting it back. First round in the Mauser project in a fully loaded mag chambered smoothly in place. Afterward usually two rounds or more popped up. I'll either live with the problem with my 458 or have it done professionally.

 

My Voere Mauser rifle, factory chambered for 308 Norma Mag. The rails are slightly tapered with the rear opened larger to allow the belted mag cartridge's rim up high enough to engage the bolt. The slightly smaller opening in the front holds the remaining cartridges in place. I had a gunsmith refuse the rail job on my Savage saying something about a taper needed for belted mags.

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