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Military Firearm Restoration Corner

Lsa V. Break Free


Dr.Hess

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I've been using Break Free for decades. I know the Army used it to clean weapons including the big gun on a M1 Abrams (they used a really big swab and Break Free by the gallon). Now, I see the Army is using "LSA" and Cheaper Than Dirt has it on sale for $7/quart. Is that going to be better than Break Free? I currently buy Break Free by the gallon when I need it. It is a log more than $7/qt.

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Been doing some Googling. The other boards seem to think that CLP (Break Free being a major brand) is good for AR platform rifles, the LSA doesn't clean like Break Free, but sticks better and is more for non-AR platforms, and Mobil 1 5W20 motor oil is a great AR lube for bolts. I'm so confused.

 

I have found that Rem Oil, the commercial stuff in the little gold cans, works better than Break Free for blued surfaces like the outside of barrels, etc., that are left exposed to the air. The Rem Oil seems to protect the bluing longer.

 

LSA = Lubricant, Small Arms, implying that it is a lube only.

CLP = Cleaner, Lubricant, Protectant. Implies that it does it all.

 

To further confuse the lube issue, when I had my airguns rebuilt (hey, you own an air rifle for 48 years, it might need a tune-up), the guy that did it (Precision Pellet, great guy to deal with, http://www.airgunshop.net/contactus.html ) told me that "PellGun Oil" was plain ATF, and to only use that on my air rifles. He basically said that selling ATF in tiny bottles at huge markup was a scam.

 

Anyway, I still have a quart or two of Break Free, so I don't need to guy rush out and buy any yet. It is like $80/gallon, though, versus $28/gallon for the LSA right now.

 

And on the Mausers, I put a little bit of Walmart private label Supertech grease in a small cosmetics mini-jar thing and put a dab of that on the bolt lugs when I clean them, and Break Free on the rest of the bolt.

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I've always viewed CLP as an "all-in-one", and that's why the army uses it. I don't think it cleans as well as other products. I prefer using a separate "cleaner" and "preserver".

 

For cleaning, a patch soaked in Shooter's Choice does wonders for copper fouling, and it's excellent for burnt powder as well. I'll use it for the bore and crevices. People swear by Kroil, but I've never tried it.

 

For preserving and general lubrication, I'm not that picky; as long as it's safe for wood and sticks, I'm good. If I happen to have CLP on-hand, I use it. Rem-Oil, Hoppes, Browning Oil... It's all the same. I use it sparingly and am happy.

 

For lucking lugs and such, I have and old tube of Shooter's Choice grease. It's red and looks suspiciously like Lucas bearing grease, but I doubt I could prove it.

 

For all-out weather preservation, I'd probably forgo oil and use Johnson's Paste Wax. There's another product called Butcher's Wax; folks use it for preserving raw brass musical instruments and hold it Holy; might be worth a look.

 

If LSA is cheaper, use it.

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The wheel bearing grease I use on lugs is red synthetic. A lot better than what was available when the rifles were made, that's for sure. I've seen those M1 5W20 references. I have some Supertec 5W20 synthetic in the shop. It's made by Mobile 1. I may try it. My Genuine Mobile 1 oils are 10W40 for the turbo/insane stuff.

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Doc a few years back a member of my gun club that worked as he said "for the govt". All anybody knew he worked as a civilian and not the military. I watched him one day clean a full auto M-16. He used Break Free on everything except the friction points on the bolt where he used LSA. When asked why he said something like "that's the way we did it" with no further explanation.

 

He was a walking-talking encyclopedia on US military weapons. He died in a house fire living in a house he built like a fortress.

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I hope he didn't die because he couldn't get out of the house.

 

Before I started buying Break Free by the gallon (the first 3 quarts were a gift from a friend), I used TriFlow for everything, including AR's. The shop I bought my AR at years ago said "Use this, as it's the only thing that will keep an AR running." That was, uh, 35 years ago. Things change. Anyway, I even used TriFlow as an assembly lube for a Lotus Twincam motor I built. Good Stuff.

 

I've seen references to people using Break Free on everything and LSA or Mobil1 20W50 on the AR bolt. The Break Free should deposit Teflon on the bolt after it evaporates, but the M1 is said to not evaporate, even after hundreds of rounds through an AR.

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I hope he didn't die because he couldn't get out of the house.

You guessed right. Heavy screens and bars over the windows prevented him and his wife from escaping. Paper said they both perished from smoke inhalation. He seemed to have inside knowledge of the conflict between the CIA and Cubans in 1970's Africa.

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For all-out weather preservation, I'd probably forgo oil and use Johnson's Paste Wax. There's another product called Butcher's Wax; folks use it for preserving raw brass musical instruments and hold it Holy; might be worth a look.

According to somebody claiming to be a museum curator on the Smith and Wesson forum. Museums use Renaissance Wax brand exclusively on metal. He claimed Johnson's, Aero and other brands of paste wax are slightly acidic. It was on the Internet so it has to be true!! Other posters in the thread were all in agreement.
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According to somebody claiming to be a museum curator on the Smith and Wesson forum. Museums use Renaissance Wax brand exclusively on metal. He claimed Johnson's, Aero and other brands of paste wax are slightly acidic. It was on the Internet so it has to be true!! Other posters in the thread were all in agreement.

I have a jar of Renaissance Wax, and I've used it with success on an old raw brass bugle I have. Fingerprints eventually show, but it helped keep them away for a quite a while.I haven't delved into using it with firearms yet.

 

I like the stuff, but application is slower than with oil. There are a couple reviews on YouTube on using it with firearms, and there was much enthusiasm. I might play with it in the future.

 

The mention of Johnson's Paste Wax came from Finn Aagaard, I believe. He was talking about weatherproofing rifles, and talked about pulling the barreled action, waxing everything with multiple coats, then putting everything back. Always liked Finn, and his no-nonsense approach.

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I used Johnsons on bayonets I stashed in my vault and forgotten about for apx 12 years. I buffed the wax off and put them on Ebay. No oxidation and they looked just fine. Even after the years they sat untouched with a heavy coat of wax they shined up just fine.

 

Whomever claims wax as a good barrier against glass bedding needs to be strung up!!

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When I did that last 7mm Mauser and blued it with some cold blue, I put some once a year car wax on it and it worked great.

 

I think I'll start saving my 5W30 full synthetic motor oil drippings when I do an oil change. I used to save it, but ran out of things to use it on. I'll start up again. Just set the jug upside down in a coffee can and let it drain out for an hour or whatever. You can get a lot of otherwise wasted oil that way.

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.

 

I think I'll start saving my 5W30 full synthetic motor oil drippings when I do an oil change. I used to save it, but ran out of things to use it on. I'll start up again. Just set the jug upside down in a coffee can and let it drain out for an hour or whatever. You can get a lot of otherwise wasted oil that way.

Back in my days as an outside auto parts salesman and gas stations were service stations. Often ran into stations that had what they called drip racks. The residual oil usually from the cans sitting upside down over night. Was collected and often re-sold. That was back when oil, STP and Motor Honey were sold in one quart cans.

 

In the mid-70's when I was peddling parts to fleets after the mom n pop service stations were gone. We got involved in a study comparing synthetic to petroleum motor oil. I left the job before the study was complete but was around long enough the lab determined the synthetic oil did in fact last longer. The same lab determined STP simply thickened the oil. If I recall correctly, one pint of STP changed five quarts of SAE 30 to something like 38 weight. A short time later after govt pressure STP was forced to stop most of their advertising clams.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Went into NAPA today. They had Mobil 1 Full Synthetic for $5.80 a quart on select items.

 

I bought a quart of 15w50. The 20w50 (for motorcycles) was a full $12.00.

 

A quart fills many 4-oz oilers. I now have a long-term oil supply for firearms, unless someone determines that lard, hazelnut oil, or lamp oil is a better alternative. I'm sure the Colorado boys will have hemp oil as a superior product.

 

Will I have to re-oil my rifles every 5,000 miles?

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The full synthetics are good for at least 5K miles, and some people (and car companies recommend) intervals of 7-10K miles. So I think you're good to go there.


Yeah, that V-Twin M1 stuff is super expensive. I probably have some on the shelf. I have 3 Harleys, but 2 of them do not like full synthetic. Make all kinds of funny noises on the stuff.

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