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#1 brian923

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Posted 30 May 2008 - 03:01 PM

what does this accomplish. iread a lot about high end sporterized mauser having the action ground. why would one do this. are there any websites or books out there that explain this, and how to do it? i am guessing that once ground, the action would have to be re-hardended... right? any info on re-hardening mauser actions? thanks a lot guys, brian

#2 littlecanoe

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Posted 30 May 2008 - 04:28 PM

The grinding gives you a very smooth surface to blue. Some re-harden the action some don't.
z1r had a nice tutorial on removing the charger hump and stoning the action. Gives a nice clean look.
It may be archived but should be easy to find. It's complete with pics to show the process and
finished product.

#3 donmarkey

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Posted 31 May 2008 - 07:14 AM

The most important reason I do it is to true up outside of the action. Mauser were never designed to be scoped and the ring can vary in size and aren't in alignment with each other plus the changer hump. When you grind the action you make sure everything is perfect alignment and true and parallel. You also then know the geometry of the action to make your scope mounts to match. Plus it likes nice and eliminates a lot of polishing. And grinding alone is no reason to need to get the action recarberized. Only the inside of the action needs to be hard. But if you go through the trouble or expense to grind the action what's a few extra dollars to reharden the action to make sure it'll last. Here's one in the process of being trued up.
-Don


#4 brian923

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Posted 31 May 2008 - 01:01 PM

can the same preocess be accomplished by use of a milling machine? i know that a grinder can make it a lot more smooth, but i have ready access to a CNC mill. i do, however, have accsess to a grinder, but its hard to get out to where it is. my father in law is using it alot, but ill see if we cant get something acomplished. thanks guys, brian

oh, to make a mandrel to, what size threads do i need to cut onto the mandrel. the action i have right now is a turk so i believe it has to be small ring dimension


#5 donmarkey

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Posted 31 May 2008 - 01:38 PM

QUOTE (brian923 @ May 31 2008, 03:01 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
can the same preocess be accomplished by use of a milling machine?


The one in the pic is being done in a mill. I true it with a carbine endmill then either switch to a cup wheel or just stone the marks out.
-Don

#6 donmarkey

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Posted 31 May 2008 - 01:42 PM

QUOTE (brian923 @ May 31 2008, 03:01 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
oh, to make a mandrel to, what size threads do i need to cut onto the mandrel. the action i have right now is a turk so i believe it has to be small ring dimension


.980 12tpi 55deg form.
-Don


#7 brian923

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Posted 31 May 2008 - 03:25 PM







QUOTE (donmarkey @ May 31 2008, 02:38 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
The one in the pic is being done in a mill. I true it with a carbine endmill then either switch to a cup wheel or just stone the marks out.
-Don



i thought that i saw a milling machine there, but i figured i would ask if that was what you did it with, or if it was set up in the mill for something else you were planning on doing to it. it looks really good, and i think it may be something i do to mine. this is a picture of my first true custom build. its a turk 1940 8x57. i bought the stock, inletted it for the timney trigger, and stained it myself. the action and barrel were pitted pretty well, but the rails on the inside of the action were in very good condition. the barrel was pitted on the outside, but the bore was okay. i would like to actually take the rifle back apart, and alter a couple things on it since i have learned a lot of new things since the build. i would like to replace the barrel with another in 8x57, but i am having a hard time finding an 8x57 barrel pre threaded for a small ring action. i might just have to see if i can get one made, but also seeing if my brother in law can do it. the only thing with that is having to spend more money on chamber reamers, gauges, and barrel blanks. i then would like to grind, or mill the action flat, and drill and tap it for a scope base. i did the bolt handle myself, and will take all the critisisum since the job turned out absolutly crappy. is there anyone that can fix this for me? i thought i saw a gentleman that fixes bubbade bolts around here. i need your help. io actually dont know if i might have to just reploace the bolt completely. well see what you'all think.

any input form you guys would also be appreciated as all i want to do is keep learning. i love to do this, and look forward to making an evern more magnificent rifle. thanks again guys, brian.

#8 donmarkey

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Posted 31 May 2008 - 05:16 PM

I've seen a lot worse first bolt attempts. And there isn't much you can do with one of those GPC handles anyway, but there are a few people here that can take care of it for you. Mike (z1r) and Rod (Tanglewood) come to mind or if your not in a hurry I could take care of it for you. As for the barrel there are a few makers that will make you long or short chambered barrel.

#9 brian923

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Posted 31 May 2008 - 08:10 PM

how long are you talking? how much would you charge to fix it? (remove old handle, and install a new one? i would have sometime as i think that i want to try to start this project soon, so it'll be down for a while.

also, if the bore of the rifle is okay, do you think that if i shortened it a little, cut a new crown, remove the steps in the barrel conture and remove rear sight it ould be worth it to see if the barrel was a shooter, or do you think it would be better to just start with a new barrel? about 150,00 for barrel, and 50 for reamer, about 220 for both shipped to my door. (for brand new douglas XX premium barrel)

anyone know where i can get a used, but good condition 8 mm barrel?

#10 tanglewood16137

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Posted 31 May 2008 - 08:47 PM

I would have to look but i should have some really nice turk 8 mm bbls

#11 donmarkey

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Posted 01 June 2008 - 06:31 AM

QUOTE (tanglewood16137 @ May 31 2008, 10:47 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I would have to look but i should have some really nice turk 8 mm bbls


That sounds like the way to go. Swap it out and keep yours for the next project. I have 3 guard orders to get out and am going out of town so I can't start anything new until atleast the middle of August. As for the barrel I'd try it out what do you have to lose. If you want to swap it out you can get pre threaded and lond chambered barrels from Lothar Walther for about 2 bills. They keep them in stock last I checked. It's save you from having to buy a reamer.
-Don


#12 brian923

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Posted 01 June 2008 - 06:42 AM

thats sounds great guys, let me know whenever you find the barrels, and if you want to get rid of any. i am interested.

#13 donmarkey

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Posted 01 June 2008 - 07:13 AM

I just re-read Rod's post I thought he said bolts not barrels, anyway I bet he has a couple of those laying around too. Time for another cup of coffee.
-Don

#14 brian923

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Posted 02 June 2008 - 03:35 PM

well, i got a machinist to do some work for me. my brother in law wants some electrical work done, so in return, hes going to turn and thread a barrel for me, and work the action. i took one of the barrels i have for a savage build, and am going to make it into a 7x57 AI for my mauser. i think this will work out nicly. i already have this barrel, and its a benchrest barrel, so it sohould be good enough for hunting. well, see... if nothing else, it should go boom!!! wink.gif

what do you guys think about the 7x57 ackley improved?? is it worth it, or better to stick with the regular 7x57. and, can i use 8x57 brass to create the ACkley 7x57 brass.. just because i have a couple rounds.

#15 gun nutty

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Posted 02 June 2008 - 03:43 PM

I'd go with the 280 Rem before the 7X57AI.

I'm guessing the capacities are identical (or almost). Should be less work making it feed. Components (dies) are much cheaper, and for those who might care (I don't), factory ammo is available.

#16 brian923

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Posted 02 June 2008 - 04:00 PM

will the .280 work in a turk mauser?? in another post, i was told to stick to the 7x57 mauser on the small ring mauser. now, i hav read anoth er post here, cant find it right now, but it was about the difference between having more barrel steel around the cartridge on a large ring mauser compared to more action steel around the cartrige on a small ring mauser, and how this can affect the type of pressures that the action can take.

what is the maximum safe pressure that the turk action can take? i have wanted to do a .280 build for a long time, but figured that i was restricted to the 7x57. which is a very good round, but i can find more .280 ammo availible than 7x57. i do reload so this isnt the end all be all, but i just like the .280. also, will the C.O.A.L of the .280 work on the turk 98 action? the 7x57 seems to be a little shorter, which would allow the use of longer VLD bull;ets that i have to load for any 7mm i decide to go... thanks for everything, brian.

#17 gun nutty

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Posted 02 June 2008 - 05:17 PM

The only issue with a Turk is the minor thread diameter. The general "rule" is that case heads should be limited to 30'06 (.470") case head diameter. The length of the case is not relevant (as long as it will feed from the magazine).

The 7x57, 30'06, 270 Win, 280 Rem, 8MM Mauser, .308 Win, etc are all .470". If you can chamber for a 7x57 AI, you can certainly chamber for for a .280 Rem.

#18 tinkerfive

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Posted 02 June 2008 - 05:19 PM

QUOTE (brian923 @ Jun 2 2008, 06:00 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
will the .280 work in a turk mauser??
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Which Turk Mauser ( 93, 03, 38 ) ????????????????????????
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

in another post, i was told to stick to the 7x57 mauser on the small ring mauser. now, i hav read anoth er post here, cant find it right now, but it was about the difference between having more barrel steel around the cartridge on a large ring mauser compared to more action steel around the cartrige on a small ring mauser, and how this can affect the type of pressures that the action can take.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>


Me thinks that you are confusing "small ring" for 'small thread shank'.
Generally speaking the pre98 type actions are referred to as "small ring" actions
and '98' type actions are referred to as "large ring" actions.

The action ring OD of a pre 98 is smaller than a 98.

Small ring actions were designed for cartridges that generally speaking run around 45000 PSI
AND they have NO third safety lug.
Let me say this again, small ring ( pre 98 ) actions have NO THIRD SAFETY LUG.

A 280 might run 56000 PSI, I don't know about you but I wouldn't feel comfortable putting my
face behind the bolt of a gun without a safety lug that was only designed for 45000 psi to start with.


>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>


what is the maximum safe pressure that the turk action can take? i have wanted to do a .280 build for a long time, but figured that i was restricted to the 7x57. which is a very good round, but i can find more .280 ammo availible than 7x57. i do reload so this isnt the end all be all, but i just like the .280. also, will the C.O.A.L of the .280 work on the turk 98 action? the 7x57 seems to be a little shorter, which would allow the use of longer VLD bull;ets that i have to load for any 7mm i decide to go... thanks for everything, brian.


>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
If your "Turk" is a 93, forget about AI or 280 and just enjoy the 7X57.
If your "Turk" is an 03, AI is certainly an option, I don't know if it's long enough for a 280
without some work.
If your "Turk" is a 38 ( K. Khale) , go AI or 280, there should be no length problems with
the possible exception of when using 'spire' bullets.

YMMV

Tinker


The above pressure ratings were for reference only,
I didn't go to my Knudhusen for the specific numbers.

#19 brian923

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Posted 02 June 2008 - 06:42 PM

my turk rifle is a 1940 k. kale rifle. serial num# 302**, and the chamber has a marking that states 7.91. i am guessing for a tight bore. but it should shoot .323 8 mm bullets. i know thats of no use now that i am going to change the barrel anyways, but if i can save the barrel, it should be good for another build wink.gif it will never stop. i can see this now.

as to the bullet type, i got a box of 7mm 168 grn berger VLD's. i think that these would work wonders on game,. and be acceptionaly accurate. now, i just have to locate a .280 chamber reamer. i dont know if going AI would be worth it or not. i would be able to fit a little bit more powder in it though, which would make up for the powder space lost due to the longer bullets. we'll see. i know i dont have to stick with the bergers, but i like the way that they shoot, so hopefully. start building we shall.

brian.

now, all i need to figure out is the bolt situation, and i should be set.

#20 z1r

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Posted 02 June 2008 - 10:27 PM

QUOTE (brian923 @ Jun 2 2008, 06:42 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
my turk rifle is a 1940 k. kale rifle. serial num# 302**, and the chamber has a marking that states 7.91. i am guessing for a tight bore. but it should shoot .323 8 mm bullets. i know thats of no use now that i am going to change the barrel anyways, but if i can save the barrel, it should be good for another build wink.gif it will never stop. i can see this now.

as to the bullet type, i got a box of 7mm 168 grn berger VLD's. i think that these would work wonders on game,. and be acceptionaly accurate. now, i just have to locate a .280 chamber reamer. i dont know if going AI would be worth it or not. i would be able to fit a little bit more powder in it though, which would make up for the powder space lost due to the longer bullets. we'll see. i know i dont have to stick with the bergers, but i like the way that they shoot, so hopefully. start building we shall.

brian.

now, all i need to figure out is the bolt situation, and i should be set.


Why would you loose powder space with the 168 vld's? You have a standard length mag box which allows seating the bullets out longer than you could in an intermediate action which most 7x57's were built on. I'd pick the cartridge that you WANT then build it. Me, I'm lazy so it would be either the 7x57 or .280.





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