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Best type of Mauser low safety


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#1 usmc0332

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Posted 06 December 2005 - 04:47 PM

I am getting down to some metal polishing, and then cold bluing. Next I need to figure out a low safety. I have seen the forged low safety thread, but think I will pass on that method this time. I have never held a rifle with the low swing style. I don't know which is best, or even if I want left side or right. Please share your thoughts.

#2 swamp_thing

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Posted 06 December 2005 - 05:01 PM

my favorite styles of safeties for the mauser with a scope would have to be the beuhler style safety, or the safety on the timney trigger assembly. I have used both and they are well suited for the job. If I were to be using a timney trigger I would probably go with the trigger/safety combination. Otherwise, it would be beuhler style for sure.
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#3 724wd

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Posted 06 December 2005 - 05:03 PM

I like the DAYTON TRAISTER MARK II SAFETY (Sporter Express $19.99 Item #: 400-116). it hangs to the right side and is pretty easy to install. you will need to notch the bolt shroud a little bit, no big deal. also you will have to bevel an edge on the cocking piece, but i think you will with most of them. I have been tempted to get one of the left side $9.99 safeties from Sporter Express just to see how they work. my preference is right side because i find it easier to engage the safety with my right had than take my left hand off the fore end to work it. disengaging the safety is easy either way.

i know some like the side-swing Mod 70 style, and if i could find one that was affordable and looked good, i'd probably have one, too, but the modified military shoroud conversion doesnt appeal to me.

i have no experience with the Bueler safety that attaches with the screw, not sure how they work.

#4 Terry

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Posted 06 December 2005 - 06:04 PM

My favorite is the 3 position Dakota and Gentry safeties. They look nice and work to perfection. The only problem is installing the dang things. I've tried twice and can't do it. Both times a real gunsmith had to bail me out.

My second favorite is the original FN safety (left side.) These I can do. The left side seems a little strange till you use it. I choose this type for My .375H&H Whitworth because it works very natual with a right handed shooter.

I've used the DAYTON TRAISTER MARK II SAFETY once with no complants.

No experince with a Beuler (sp?) safety.

The ones I really don't care for are the 2 position side swing safeties (M70 style) that you use witha converted military bolt shroud. They're a real pain to get right and seem to want to dis-engage when you don't want them too. That's experience with them anyway.

Terry

#5 fritz

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Posted 06 December 2005 - 06:47 PM

What 724wd said,
But they are cheaper at Brownell's, around 15 bucks if you have a C&R and that's up from a year or so ago. Stay away from the cheapy left-side safeties, the cheapest you are going to be satisfied with are the Dayton's. If money is no object, the Buehler safety is great.

I have about 30 Mausers with the Dayton-Traister safeties, and they have never failed me. They were one of the first safeties I used in the 60's. The fitting requires a nothch cut in the shroud, a Dremel tool with a reinforced wheel works great for this. You will not have to do as much beveling of the cocking piece with them as you will have to do with the cheapy left-side crap. And the cheapiesd are made of softer metal.

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#6 montea6b

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Posted 06 December 2005 - 07:15 PM

My Dayton Traister safety hit the scope when engaged. I changed it out for a Chapman which I now like better anyhow.

The "good" rifle will be getting a Dakota.

#7 Doble Troble

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Posted 06 December 2005 - 07:16 PM

I like this one the best.

And it's free*.

*unless you value your time at $100/hr in which case it costs about $600 your first go round. After that they're only half price biggrin.gif !

#8 montea6b

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Posted 06 December 2005 - 07:19 PM

My Dayton Traister safety hit the scope when engaged. I changed it out for a Chapman which I now like better anyhow.

The "good" rifle will be getting a Dakota.

Using the left hand was referenced for using a left side safety... I'd stay away from the left side cheapies for other reasons, but the thumb should curl over to the left side of the pistolgrip where the safety is anyhow, and the older FNs had a good safety that was left mounted, so I wouldn't let awkwardness be your determining factor.

#9 roscoedoh

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Posted 06 December 2005 - 07:35 PM

For your first rifle, use a Dayton-Traister or Timney Beuhler. You can't go wrong with it either. I opted for the Timney Beuhler on my first rifle and can't really complain. However, they are awkard to learn to operate and if they're on a rifle with QD scope mounts, you're prone to accidentally pushing it to the "fire" position with the scope off.

I got short of time and opted for a side-safety trigger on my second rifle but that will get changed to something more mechanically sound once I have a better income. I know that Remingtons the world over use them and I know they're good enough for military sniper rifles - but they don't block the sear and that leaves a little too much margin for error in my mind.

Hands down, I heartily recommend the 2 position or 3 position Winchester style safeties. Both are expensive and everyone but me seems to dislike the 2 position models; but they work! I didn't have too much trouble adjusting it either. I'm presently going back and forth on whether to convert everything else over to these or spend a little more per rifle and step up to a 3 position. I plan on using QD mounts for virtually everything else I build - save one - and again, I don't like the Beuhler type for this application.

Just my $.02.

Jason

#10 724wd

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Posted 06 December 2005 - 07:35 PM

QUOTE(montea6b @ Dec 7 2005, 01:19 AM)
but the thumb should curl over to the left side of the pistolgrip where the safety is anyhow, and the older FNs had a good safety that was left mounted, so I wouldn't let awkwardness be your determining factor.

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montea6b, have you ever tried to engage the safety with your left thumb? i do not posess the filangial fortitude (thumb strenth on the up-stroke) to do so. my dad has an FN with the left side safety and the engagement force required dictates that you use more than your thumb. I agree, disengaging the safety is second nature, but to engage the safety is tough. biggrin.gif

#11 724wd

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Posted 06 December 2005 - 07:45 PM

fritz, i have sent my C&R to brownells and midway...but my prices seem like they are still gen. pop. prices. how do i see what the discount will be? do i have to put the items in my cart?

#12 montea6b

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Posted 06 December 2005 - 10:34 PM

QUOTE
montea6b, have you ever tried to engage the safety with your left thumb? i do not posess the filangial fortitude (thumb strenth on the up-stroke) to do so. my dad has an FN with the left side safety and the engagement force required dictates that you use more than your thumb. I agree, disengaging the safety is second nature, but to engage the safety is tough.


Actually, I don't think I have! I have handled several with this type safety and it seemed like a natural enough location to me. I guess I was primarily thinking about disengagement which would undoubtedly be easier...

Good point 724wd, thanks for pointing it out. The upward engagement of the Dayton Traister was awkward enough in its own right. The thumb just wasn't meant to operate that way with any degree of strength.

P.S. Don't know what happened with the goofy double post... I didn't realize that the first one made it.

#13 carzngunz

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Posted 06 December 2005 - 10:41 PM

I have three of the Timney safeties, several of the cheap left hand models and one of the Chapman style two position side swings. The Timneys work great. Like roscoedoh, I really like the two position side swing. It's not the prettiest when installed but it works well and is easier for me to use than the other style. Several people have said a lot of negative things about them lately but other than looks, they hold the striker back just like all the other ones. Also it CAN be installed with a drill, 6-48 tap, cutoff wheel and a file.

#14 roscoedoh

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Posted 07 December 2005 - 01:09 AM

I'll add to my previous comments by sharing my experience with the Chapman conversion safety.

About two years ago, I bought one those ever available "Winchester style 2 position" safeties off eBay; $60 delivered. And not the left out of the party, I had hell with the safety wing slipping and releasing the cocking piece, just like everyone else gripes about. However, before I deduced that I had a worthless safety, I had also bought the Chapman conversion tooling off eBay with the idea of horse trading the tools for someone's time to convert my other bolt shrouds over. Included with these tools were the instructions.

Fast forward two years. This summer, I finally got off my butt and got my 30-06 put together and had every intention of using my eBay Chapman. I put all the parts together and things fit just fine - until the drop test. Call me rough, but once I get a rifle assembled I drop it, butt first, on the asphalt outside to test the holding capability of the safety. Well, my good deal turned out to be quite defective! So, not knowing what else to do, I dug out the instructions (fancy that, eh?). After organizing them (they're hard to read on the first pass), I realized that my eBay good deal was a mere Chapman knock-off and that further the section of the safety wing was worn down too far to be much good. OK, great! A quick call to Brownell's solved this problem by merely ordering a new Chapman parts kit. I had to do some fitting and little filing, but in the end, I got it to work. It works well as a matter of fact! I can drop the rifle on the butt or side, kick it, slap it, hell probably drive over it with my truck, and the safety won't release until I ease the lever forward with my thumb. Looks aside, that's a hell of a functional safety!

I assume that most of the slippage problems that most encounter with these safeties stem from the fact that I bet most people have bought them sight unseen or off eBay with the idea that they're a drop in fit - they're not. I urge everyone who has slippage problems to consider refitting Chapman (or PME?) parts from Brownell's or getting a gunsmith to look at it for them. I've read here and there where most people hate the conversion safeties because they're known to slip. Based on my experiences so far, I can say with proper fitting - that just ain' the case.

Jason

#15 Guest_Guest_MorgansBoss_*_*

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Posted 07 December 2005 - 01:53 AM

Whew! You sure ask interesting questions Beau. Love to see these sort of discussions going. I haven't been able to read all the posts so I hope I'm not re-treading anything but my personal preferences and my usual route are not the same. rolleyes.gif I'd love to put pretty replacement shroud/safety combos on every rifle but alas... I'm basicly a cheapskate. What I typically end up using is a shop-modified Buehler-style (right side) safety from the original. I actually prefer the checkered Swedish safeties for this. When I get home latter today I'll try to locate and post a sketch demonstrating how its done. All it takes is some judicious grinding via the ever present Dremel tool to move the "fire" notch to a new location, thinning the lever and notching the shroud. I don't like the little plastic retaining bead on some commercial replacements and I do not like the hogged-out look of the M98 to Winchester-style conversions, although this is perhaps the best safety. I do like and use a side safety when I use a replacement trigger - which ain't often. If this is your first and you are replacing the trigger, use one with a safety. They're only a few bucks more and worth every penny. You can do a bolt safety conversion later when you're not as anxious to shoot your latest project! wink.gif

#16 z1r

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Posted 07 December 2005 - 01:24 PM

QUOTE(724wd @ Dec 7 2005, 01:35 AM)
montea6b, have you ever tried to engage the safety with your left thumb?  i do not posess the filangial fortitude (thumb strenth on the up-stroke) to do so.  my dad has an FN with the left side safety and the engagement force required dictates that you use more than your thumb.  I agree, disengaging the safety is second nature, but to engage the safety is tough.  biggrin.gif

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Can I add something here, I don't remember these safties being that hard to engage but I would like to add that rarely have I found the need to enage the safety while my hand was still on the grip. The one GPC FN knock off safety I used was hard but that is probably more a matter of fitment.


#17 Guest_TONEY_*

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Posted 07 December 2005 - 03:36 PM

QUOTE(Doble Troble @ Dec 6 2005, 07:16 PM)
I like this one the best.

And it's free*.

*unless you value your time at $100/hr in which case it costs about $600 your first go round.  After that they're only half price  biggrin.gif !

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I have wondered about tweeking the orignal. I have just been pushing mine up as far as it will go, being a lefty it is easy pulling it down with my thumb

That's some good looking wood on your rifle

#18 Terry

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Posted 08 December 2005 - 07:38 PM

Double post deleted

Edited by Terry, 08 December 2005 - 08:47 PM.


#19 Terry

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Posted 08 December 2005 - 07:41 PM

TIP: Buy a tube of copper based anti-seize compound and put a little dab between the safety and the cocking piece after installing and timing any of these safeties. It makes a huge difference. You can get it at almost any auto parts store.

Terry

#20 MorgansBoss

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Posted 08 December 2005 - 08:11 PM

Here's the sketch I promised. It is a general layout. Actual position of cuts, bevels, etc. will have to be fit as you go. The key is to GO SLOW and take only the minimum off at a time, trying often. This goes for the slot in the shroud as well. Where it gets really tricky on the first couple is getting the cuts just right so the safety does not pop out between the "engaged" and off position (where it is retained by the slot).

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