TLynn Posted July 3, 2005 Report Share Posted July 3, 2005 AzRednek 1 Posts: 373 (6/25/05 22:08) Reply Muzzle Brakes -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- A close friend of mine was complaining about the recoil of his old 350 Norma Mag. I know exactly how he feels, seems like since I passed the half-century mark in age, rifles seem heavier and I’m more recoil sensitive. I suggested he look into a muzzle brake and a good recoil pad. I’ve never shot a rifle with a muzzle brake but several years ago I handled a friend’s S&W 44 mag with a Magna-Ported barrel. There was an obvious reduction in muzzle flip and whether real or imagined an over all reduction in recoil. We compared the same loads in his 8 3/8 to my 6 inch both S&W Model 29's. My friend called me this afternoon telling me he was quoted from 220-375 bux for the brake and pad. I did a little surfing on the net and have determined the local prices are pretty much the going rate. He also told me one gunsmith told him muzzle brakes are over-rated and because of the cost he would be better off dollar-wise his selling vintage rifle and buying a new or used 308 or 30/06 for Elk. My first question, any idea why the cost of a muzzle brake is so expensive?? I’m not a gunsmith but it seems to me with the proper tools the installation shouldn’t be a labor intensive project. I just can’t seem to justify 2 inches of factory mass produced steel parts being that expensive. Does anybody have any first hand knowledge or experience of using the same rifle with and without a muzzle brake you might want to share?? Does it really reduce felt recoil enough to justify the cost?? In my friend’s case he can easily afford the cost but on the other hand the gunsmith’s advice of down sizing is seems to me to be a more logical path to follow. fritz501 The Gentleman Farmer & Piglet Exterminator Posts: 2390 (6/25/05 22:38) Reply Re: Muzzle Brakes -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- There's no need to "downsize" on caliber. Either pay the normal gunsmith charge (and it does involve threading and fitting the brake to the barrel) or just buy a new rifle with the BOSS or similar system. Buying a new rifle, in your caliber, with the factory installed recoil-reducing systems would seem to be more cost affective. But it's your money. Be advised that a gunsmith will not install one of these aftermarket brakes for a few bucks. We have a gunshop here that is connected with Kleingunther, or at least was. His work was top-notch. Not cheap, but top-notch. BTW, installing a muzzle brake increases the noise. So wear those ear protectors (unless you are already as deaf as I am). Even then, I would never be that hard of hearing had it not been for my neglect. fritz "It seemed like yesterday, but it was long ago---we were young and strong and running against the wind" z1r 1 Posts: 2872 (6/25/05 22:51) Reply Re: Muzzle Brakes -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- I for one hate muzzle brakes! Like fritz said, they add substantially to the noise. Your buddy would likely be way better off getting a nice, new, plush, thick, recoil pad. The new pads are incredibly good at absorbing recoil. I assume he handloads? If recoil is an issue why not simply down load? 99% of the time you have no real need for Magnum loads anyway. That would be the cheapest route yet! albertashooter 1 Posts: 44 (6/25/05 22:53) Reply Re: Muzzle Brakes -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- I have fired a few rifles with muzzle brakes and they can reduce recoil quite a bit, but with quite a cost in noise and muzzle blast. I would not own a rifle with one as I do not believe the trade off is a good one. I would rather have the recoil and still keep my hearing. As you get older you get hard of hearing fast enough without speeding it up in this fashion. A good recoil pad is well worth it and can help quite a bit.The stock ones sometimes seem to be made of old tires,are hard as a rock and are of little use. I think he should follow the gunsmiths advice and get a 30-06. More than enough for elk. Reverend Recoil 1 Posts: 287 (6/25/05 23:13) Reply Re: Muzzle Brakes -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Muzzle brakes do work well. The recoil of a rifle can be divided into two parts. The first part is the reaction of the bullet’s momentum. The only way to change that part is switch to a load with a lighter bullet or one with slower velocity. The second part is the momentum of the expanding gas driving the bullet. This can be calculated by multiplying the mass of the gunpowder (it is all converted to gas) by the speed of the bullet. When the bullet leaves the muzzle the gas creates a thrust like the exhaust of a rocket. A muzzle brake works by changing the direction of the gas 90 degrees. This change in direction causes the muzzle brake to react by pulling on the barrel, thus negating some of the recoil. Muzzle brakes work best with small bore magnum cartridges such as 270 Weatherby, 7mm Rem, and 300 Win. Muzzle brakes are less effective with cartridges such as 350 Norma and 375 H&H because a larger part of the recoil is due to the bullet’s momentum. The down side of all muzzle brakes is an increase in muzzle blast and to some, its appearance. Gunsmiths are business people like any other. Cost has no bearing on price. A good business person charges what the market will bear. Installing a muzzle break is not hard to due but it requires skill and an investment in expensive machinery and tooling. If you want the job done cheap, thread the end of your barrel with a pipe die, smear on some J-B Weld and turn on a muzzle break with vise-grip pliers. If you want it done right, take it to a good gunsmith and pay what he charges. You will have to decide whether or not the expense is worth the benefit. fritz501 The Gentleman Farmer & Piglet Exterminator Posts: 2392 (6/25/05 23:23) Reply Re: Muzzle Brakes -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- You are right, reverend The local 'smith speciallized in Weatherby magnums, and he installed quite a few of the brakes on those Weatherby magnums. But then they were Weatherby magnums. Not everybody needs a Weatherby magnum. fritz "It seemed like yesterday, but it was long ago---we were young and strong and running against the wind" donmarkey 1 Posts: 46 (6/26/05 7:55) Reply muzzle brakes -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Even before installing a brake, get a real reciol pad. You will probably find you allready reduced felt recoil alot and since he has been shooting this gun all along, he's allready somewhat used to the recoil. Muzzle brakes are great for target shooting where you can wear earmuffs, but I for one don't want my ears ringing for 2 days after hunting. Don mod70 1 Posts: 187 (6/26/05 12:05) Reply ezSupporter Re: muzzle brakes -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The 'x-coil' recoil pads are the most effective I have used. I had the treat of shooting a few groups from the bench with an Ed Brown 338 win mag fitted with one of their brakes the other day. The rifle, topped with a Swarovski scope and 3 rds in the mag (edit), weighed less than 8 lbs. It is the first braked large caliber rifle I have ever fired and until then had always had a less than positive veiw on brakes BUT -- I came away with a whole new attitude. I too am over the hill and the bigger mags sure seem to buck more than they used to but this rifle felt like shooting a 243 to me! I had been shooting Turk and Yugo Mausers for a couple hours that day, and my old arthritic shoulder was already 'aware' of that fact, so I was quite impressed that the 338 seemed like such a pussycat. I'm sure it had something to do with stock fit and the Pachmyer decelerator pad on the Ed Brown but a lot of it was due to the brake. Another thing I noticed was that this brake was not nearly as loud as most of them I have been around. I don't know how that is accomplished but it was definitely quiter than any I have heard. Makes me want to get one for the only magnum rifle I still own. Edited by: mod70 at: 6/27/05 6:44 z1r 1 Posts: 2875 (6/26/05 12:30) Reply Re: muzzle brakes -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Mod70, You mentioned something here that most overlook: Stock Design, then fit. Nothing plays a bigger role in mitigating recoil, except of course a smaller caliber. Most stocks are ill fit to the shooter as they tend to be of the one size fits all ilk. grumpy64 1 Posts: 2 (6/26/05 15:08) Reply Re: muzzle brakes -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- I too, am over 50 and find that my K31, MN 91/30, 12 ga., etc. cause some discomfort - - but that's the price we pay for enjoying shooting. I bought a Romanian AK47 WASR10. The first thing I did was take it out of the wood furniture. It was awkward and uncomfortable. I put it in a ATI Fiberforce stock - much better fit. I installed a recoil buffer and recoil pad. The gun still had a lot of muzzle flip so I had a muzzle brake put on. That settled it down. With the red dot sight it is lethal at 50yards and still shoots five shot 5 inch group at 100 yds. Not bad for a AK. I have shot a mini 14 without the brake and with a brake - it does help recovery in rapid fire settings. AzRednek 1 Posts: 374 (6/26/05 20:05) Reply Re: muzzle brakes -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Thx!! for the advice and pictures, I emailed a link to this post to my friend. Jimro 1 Posts: 877 (6/27/05 23:17) Reply Re: muzzle brakes -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- A good rifle stock should make your rifle feel like a properly fitted shotgun. The butt should be big and wide to spread the recoil out, and the forearm should be large enough for you to comfortably grip and provide enough mass to mitigate recoil somewhat. The center of balance on the gun should fall slightly forward of the action, but not so barrel heavy that the rifle is slow handling. These are just my preferences, but they do make things nicer on your shoulder. Jimro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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