littlecanoe Posted December 25, 2006 Report Share Posted December 25, 2006 724wd posted on the knives that he had made. Beautiful Examples. This got my neurons to churning on the subject. I and I'm sure others are looking at trying our hand at this in the future. I've read up on it on some other forums and dedicated sites. I thought that it might be nice to start a discussion on materials and tools. I'll start the conversation by asking if old planer blades can be used. I'm assuming that they consist of high carbon steel. I know that they are brittle. Would this be good metal to start a project with? Would detempering the metal in order to shape then retempering give the appropriate "end product" for a good fixed blade skinner? What kind of tools are you guys using, basic and advanced, for the stock removal method of knifemaking? LC Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
724wd Posted December 25, 2006 Report Share Posted December 25, 2006 i think planner blades will be too hard and brittle. if i were going to start making my own blades (and i plan to) i would start with some 440 stainless bar stock or some other steel that is commonly used. here are a couple of links that have helped me.... http://www.knifenetwork.com/forum/index.php http://www.knifekits.com/ http://005cd83.netsolhost.com/index.html http://www.texasknife.com/ here is the cheapest stock removal tutorial... http://hossom.com/tutorial/jonesy/ places to buy steel... http://www.ssdamascus.com/Products.html http://www.admiralsteel.com/ http://www.sheffieldsupply.com/ heat treat companies... http://www.petersheattreat.com/ as you might be able to see on the cheap stock removal sight, you can use car spring material to fairly good effect. a drill and files are all that you NEED, but having grinders and whatnot sure makes it nice. bench mounted belt sanders are quite popular, especially for making plunge cuts. i used a drill press with drum sanders for shaping the handles on my knives. worked well, i think. i would think the same drum sanders would work for shaping steel. a mill would be nice, but not necessary. everyone over at knife network suggests getting the jantz catalog. they say it has little tutorials throughout and you can get everything you need from them. tools, steel, pins, handle material... everything. you might also check out http://www.blanklooks.com/ for some beautiful woods. they are my neighbors and as straight-shooters as you will find anywhere. and they have beautiful wood. god luck on your blades, and show your work! you might not think it's good enough, but learning is for everyone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsefly Posted December 30, 2006 Report Share Posted December 30, 2006 I'm going to build a knife this year that I won't be ashamed to show off,I hope! Thanks for the good knife websites 4x4.It's a start.I've made a few knives that work fine but look like hell,but at least I kinda know where to start.I have a belt sander and will have a buffer soon,but sure wish I had a good band saw to cut out blanks.There's a knife store in Fort Worth called House of Blades that claims to be the largest knife store in the world,and they have everything needed to make knives,but are higher than a cats ass.Maybe I need to check their prices on steel then compare what the difference would be from somewhere else with shipping.I hope we can get this going enough that others will chime in to help us beginners.724wd,looks like your going to be leader of the pack since you've made some nice knives already.Jerry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobDole Posted December 31, 2006 Report Share Posted December 31, 2006 I have made quite a few knives before and one thing i will warn you about is the buffer. Personaly i try to stay away from it as much as possible, it will be the most dangerous tool in the shop. Planer blades will work but the steel would have to be anealed first. Then shape the blade and grind the bevels, normalize, harden, and finally temper. 440 stainless is decent steel but heat treatment cannot be done at home without a oven. I would start out with 1080, 1095, or 01. 1080 and 1095 are very cheap so if you mess up pitching the blade is no big deal. The heat treatment is fairly easy, and can be accomplished with miminal tools. 01 is probably the easist steel to work with as it comes normalized, heat treatment is very easy and forgiving. There is no need to go to a knife store or order from a catalog with there high prices to get steel. The local steel yard or wedling supply shop should have or can get what you need. You can get several feet for the same price as you would for one from the catalogs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsefly Posted January 1, 2007 Report Share Posted January 1, 2007 Your right Bob,I can find steel cheaper than a knife store,if I know exactly where to go the first time.If I have to drive 30 miles each way or pay shipping,the price of the gas alone will make up the difference.A knife store is about 5 miles from me that has almost anything I'd ever need,and if I were to build a couple knives a year,the bargain hunting wouldn't be worth it.It harelips me to order something for $10.00 and pay $12.00 shipping.Your right about the tempering too.If I'm going to put a lot of time in a knife and it turns out half decent,I'm not about to try and do a homemade temper on it.It gets sent out to be hardened.I've made a few knives that work,aren't very pretty,that I tempered myself,but none will hold an edge like a Buck or Uncle Henry Goldspike.I had a knife made years ago by a guy named DeLeon in Lubbock Tex.I snapped a blade cutting through a pelvic bone on a deer and cut my hand and decided that wouldn't happen again,so I had him make me a 4'' drop point 1/4'' thick blade knife.It's a beautiful knife,a piece of art and works well for heavy cutting such as pelvic bones and rib cages,but it won't hold an edge worth a doodly squat.I carry a Buck Vanguard now for field dressing and use the other for heavy duty work.If you don't use a buffer,how do you polish your work when finished? Jerry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobDole Posted January 1, 2007 Report Share Posted January 1, 2007 Hardening and tempering a blade properly is not that hard at all. If a moron like me can do it, anyone can. In all honesty the edge holding ability of a buck or schrade is not all that good compared to a properly done blade. They are commercial knives and made for the ease of sharpening, not for the best preformance. I sent a few things to commerical heat treaters before and was not all that impressed with there results either. If it's stainless it gets sent out, but anything carbon i can do at home with similar or far better results then they can. There are some smaller guys that do a much better job then the big name guys. Doing things yourself also gives you some other options that commerical heat treaters wont. None will do a edge quench or differental hardening. Those are two things that will greatly increase the quality of the completed blade. Not every blade needs to be mirror polished, if you look at the really expenisve custom makers almost none make mirror polished blades. Some also feel that a alot of buffing smears the grain of the steel and makes it look unnatural. Sanding or polishing with stones can get a similar finish. I try to use the buffer on blades as little as possible. Even a very expirenced person has somthing thrown by the buffer every once in awhile. A sharp blade is not somthing you want thrown around your shop. I cought one point first to the thigh and many other custom makers and hobbyists have done the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doble Troble Posted June 4, 2007 Report Share Posted June 4, 2007 I've made several knives from O1 and A2 steel and various pieces of hard steel. I like O1, its easy to harden and cheap to buy. These steels are for working knives as they will stain and darken with time and use - I think this makes them look even better. For purty knives you'll probably want to go with stainless, but the hardening is a pain to do right - I've never tried it, but it might harden acceptably with a torch - might be worth a try. With O1 I've found that I can just harden the edge by heating it up with an OA torch and quenching in used motor oil, dipping only the edge about an inch deep. This results in a color change that's really cool - it kind-of looks like the Japanese swords that were edge hardened by protecting the shank with clay. You can get a glass hard edge and tougher shank this way. I don't buff either - I'm not a fraidy cat - I prefer to think of myself as moderately intellegent. I've got 400 grit belts that put a fine finish. If I wanted mirror I'd do it the old fashioned way with rubbing compound. Life is short enough. Have fun! It took me a couple of tries before I figured-out how to grind a proper blade, its nothing that can be taught or book read. It's kind of like welding - you've got to do it to figure it out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AzRednek Posted June 5, 2007 Report Share Posted June 5, 2007 Friend of mine used to run a shop that rebuillt or made from scratch, auto and truck leaf springs. He had several customers he claimed were well known knife makers. They used to come and buy raw leaf spring stock. Often short pieces cut off of spring stock was saved for the knife makers and sold pretty cheap. Reason I brought this up, if you have a spring shop in your area, you might be able to buy steel at a reasonable price. I'll try and get a picture up of one of the knives I got from my friend. The best knife maker I know is related to my X-wife. He started making knives at about 12-13. By the time he was 20 he quit taking orders. He said the only was he could enjoy his hobby and be creative, were to build them at his leisure exactly as he wanted. If you want one of his knives, you either buy what he has for sale or go elsewhere. He used to shop gunshows and made some real beautiful knives from junker bayonets. If I hadn't divorced his aunt, he was going to make me a knife from a some what hard to find, British #4 Mk1 blade bayonet. At that time he was 18-19 and had an almost 2 year waiting list. Incidently this guy claims he can speak to dead people and has made big bucks with a syndicated radio program. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AzRednek Posted June 5, 2007 Report Share Posted June 5, 2007 This was supposidly made from a Grizz knife kit, from a knife maker named Deberge in northern Arizona. My friend traded steel for it. This is what my X's nephew was going to make me a knife from. The picture doesn't show it, when I got it back from him it was highly polished. One he made from this type of bayonet, he had ground out the blood groove, shortened it apx 2-3 inches and it had a rosewood and brass hilt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
724wd Posted June 5, 2007 Report Share Posted June 5, 2007 ive been working on a few knives lately, coincidently out of leaf spring stock, 5160, purchased at the local spring shop, 3 feet for under 20 bucks. my first effort is a blatant ripoff of a benchmade resistor... the grind lines are a bit soft, but i have since worked it over and applied mustard patina. i think it's a great starter knife. i did the heat treat with the assistance of Bruce Bump, a mastersmith in Walla Walla. it's fully hardened, not edge quenched like doble troble was talking about. fully hardened was easier, and since the blade is almost a quarter of an inch thick, there's really no reason to worry about the blade bending or breaking. the 3 i am working on now are a benchmade activator, the short one, and a skinning blade based on the same handle, scaled up and with a deep bellied blade. the other is another activator, possibily for daily carry... we'll see. i am also planning on getting more steel soon, some stainless and some more carbon steel. i bought a (ok, my wife bought a) 1x42 inch belt/8 inch disc grinder. sure helps out. much better than files! and paper! anywho, i'll try to get some pics soon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
littlecanoe Posted June 7, 2007 Author Report Share Posted June 7, 2007 724wd, Sir, you have very beautiful hands............................................ lc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
724wd Posted June 8, 2007 Report Share Posted June 8, 2007 just don't piss me off! i'm sure Gail, our accounts receivable professional at work will appreciate your compliments to her hands. surely, if you're going to get pictures taken, you find a suitable model, no? =) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
littlecanoe Posted June 10, 2007 Author Report Share Posted June 10, 2007 I believe I'd only ask her AFTER she'd had her coffee. You keep inspiring me to start on knives. Now I just need motivation and time. lc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AzRednek Posted June 10, 2007 Report Share Posted June 10, 2007 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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