youngtrout Posted November 4, 2005 Report Share Posted November 4, 2005 I guess I'll chime in, even though the question seems answered. I live in Colorado and do a great deal of hunting and fishing. Of the 12 rifle elk hunters I know, there are 5 .270's, 2 7-08, 3 30-06's, a 300 win, and one 8 mag, I usually know when he has sighted it in, usually he has a nice shiner and a new pair of glasses, now its harder because he finally lightened up on magnification to get the proper clearence!!! the 3-9 leupold clearence is not enough! All of these hunters have taken a great number of elk, most with one shot. I mainly have hunted with the 270, 7-08 group. They would all have something to say about these rifles being too light for elk. I spotted a shot for my friend at a big cow last year at 400 yds with a 7-08, bullet hit in the center chest, she piled up in 10 yds, I've seen other kills with the lighter and heavier loads and see really no difference in killing ability. All of these hunter stress shot placement, and taking good percentage shots, with that I'm on my soapbox, shot placement is key, I'm tired of hearing about the guy with the cannon talking about his run-in with a bull and how he almost gotem, only to hear that he gut shot it, and gave up because he figured he was long gone (only to have a long drawn out death, count on that!) Or other close encounters that leave much to imagination of where or what those bullets hit! The country is pretty wide open in places, just because you see and can shoot at an elk at 500 yds or even 250 through cover does not mean you should. Sorry for the rant, I heard a couple of these stories a couple of days ago and realize that these hunters have traveled a long ways (some just from denver)and spent alot of money to hunt be that does not give you a free card when it comes to being an ethical hunter and taking ethical shots, okay, with that rant over. Okay the perfect elk rifle.............something over .277, accurate, accurate I mean being able to hit a pie plate at reasonable ranges, and most importantly and gun you feel comfortable shooting. I love my 270, but am planning a 338-06, varity is the spice of life Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest_MorgansBoss_* Posted November 4, 2005 Report Share Posted November 4, 2005 YT, EXCELLENT Post! You said it all my friend and with real world experience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clark Posted November 4, 2005 Report Share Posted November 4, 2005 I have shot a 10 pound Whelen, and the recoil is ok, but the power and trajectory are gone at 400 yards. I have shot a 7mm mag, the recoil is mild, the gun can be light, but it never has enough power. Playing with Quickload, calculating rifle weight, calculating recoil, looking at power and trajectory at distance, the caliber that seems optimum for elk is 8mm/338, 8mm/300WM, or a downloaded 8mm mag. This assumes a stationary target out to 400 yards, as the leading becomes ridiculas at that distance. The 300 win mag is too small and the 338 too big, but they are both close enough to work at 350 yards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsefly Posted November 4, 2005 Author Report Share Posted November 4, 2005 Youngtrout,well said! I have hunted elk with my .308 and my brother used his '06,but neither one of us took a shot because they were out of range.We've been hunting for 40 years,and neither one of us have ever lost an animal,but in the mountains and canyons,I want to see an aimal drop right there on the spot.You aint lived until you shoot a 250lb mule deer that makes 3 jumps and goes off in a canyon that takes every cable,rope and chain hooked to a jeep to drag them out.I reckon after all these years not loosing anything,I'm scared of the day it may happen,because I know I've been lucky.This year,I'm going to Big Bend mule deer hunting again,and am using 180 grain bullets in my 308.The 3 deer I shot down there have run maybe 25 yards,and that's enough to make a simple recovery into a half day ordeal.150's flatten our Texas whitetails like something was dropped on top of them.I have a .270,7mag,308,all the Mauser calibers,and am a fair shot,But,I'll admit to you dudes,150 yards is my max when hunting with any of those guns.I know they'll shoot lot's further than that,but I can't guarantee you I will hit where I want past that.The next time someone say's,"I shot it at 400 yards",just say,that must be a long ways out,show me how far 400 yards is.9 times out of 10 it won't be 250.I've only heard a couple times on this board someone talking about taking shots at 400 to 600 yards,and what my Grandmother use to say,"Bless their heart".Jerry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
youngtrout Posted November 4, 2005 Report Share Posted November 4, 2005 horsefly, also well said. That shot I described on that elk at 400 yds (actually a paced 390) was a hayfield elk, she was standing still broadside, we had a solid rest, no wind and my friend practices out to this range on a regular basis. I don't recommend shots this far on elk but condions were good, I mainly wanted to illusrate the killing power of the lighter calibers, when placed correctly I can't tell you how many elk I've passed over 200-250 and normally shots I take are in that 80-170 range. thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AzRednek Posted November 4, 2005 Report Share Posted November 4, 2005 I can’t argue with shot placement. My first wife’s great-grandmother settled, homesteaded and built a farm-ranch in northern Arizona. Elk were considered a nuisance. Cattle didn’t have a problem as long as the ranchers had a mean bull. Corralled horses were a different story. The elk would stomp crops, knock down barbed wire fences, eat the horse’s food and occasionally a horny elk bull would injure a horse trying to get lucky or fighting for control of the hareem. The ranchers had to stand guard while feeding their horses during the season the elk were migrating. If the elk couldn’t be scared away most were killed with a headshot using 22 rf or buckshot. There was such an abundance of elk meat in the area most carcases were dragged away and burned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimro Posted November 4, 2005 Report Share Posted November 4, 2005 Try these bullets in the 35 Whelen, they are a little more expensive, but if you use them only for sight in and hunting the cost is minimal http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/...leitemid=166406 http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/...leitemid=707005 http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/...leitemid=568841 I personally like the Barns triple shock because it has a great reputation for accuracy. I loaded up some 308 rounds with 165 grain triple shocks for a close in elk round, and elk season starts tomorrow. Hope I have better luck than I did for open buck. Jimro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brithunter Posted November 14, 2005 Report Share Posted November 14, 2005 Hi Horsefly, Well I would keep it in the original 7.92mm (8x57mm) and get him some of the factory S&B 196 grn SPCE ammunition which is availbe very reasonable in the US (unlike here where it costs a fortune ) this load according to S&B gives 2600 or there abouts with the 196 grn bullet and being of 0.323" doeameter it's bigger than the .30 and a bit smaller than the .35's sort of inbetween. A friend from another forum lent his 8mm Mauser to a friends son last seaon who used ot to take a good Cow on his tag in Colorado and that was using the std Remington factory (underloaded) 185?grn load, one shot kill at about 175 yards. Good luck on whatever you decide Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsefly Posted November 15, 2005 Author Report Share Posted November 15, 2005 Brithunter,your so right! There's not a thing wrong with the good old 8MM.I'm real impressed with Sellier Bellot ammo,and have never had any trouble out of it,and that's after shooting 100's of rounds through my PA63.I've got several boxes of 7x57,8MM,and 9x18 on hand right now.At 7 bucks a box for 7x57 and being hotter than U.S. loads,they're a good buy.You wouldn't be Kevin would you? Jerry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
724wd Posted November 15, 2005 Report Share Posted November 15, 2005 well guys, i spent 5 days stalking around the hills this year for elk with a .270, and did not feel undergunned. we are only allowed to shoot spikes, but even after a big bull, i am confident enough in my rifle, bullets and myself to shoot at 250 yards, about the limit of what you can see... the area i hunt, it is not terribly difficult to stalk within shooting range. in fact during bear season this year, my dad and I were treated to the scene of two mature (one 6x7 with super long, thick tines whos horns were a bit narrow and one 6x6 who was super wide, but tines were a little short and stubby) fighting. we were upwind, and they battled for almost 10 minutes solid. the heavy horned bull had blood on three tines on the left side. they fought back and forth as we watched from behind a wild rose bush and by the time we got nervous, they were an HONEST 10 feet from us! call BS if you want, but i kow what i saw, and it was amazing! with only a shrinking rosebush between us, my dad raised his arms and whooped at them. they were not going to stop, and would have run us over! being upwind, they still had no idea what we were, even after spooking them. so, moral of the story, get close! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
z1r Posted November 15, 2005 Report Share Posted November 15, 2005 Wow, That, my friend, is what hunting is all about. Who cares if you shoot anything when you have experiences like that to share! Congrats! FYI, I would use a .270 in an instant with the right bullets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brithunter Posted November 15, 2005 Report Share Posted November 15, 2005 Hi Jerry, Brithunter,your so right! You wouldn't be Kevin would you? Jerry 6958[/snapback] OK so I am busted Yep it's little ole me And no I didn't get to go chasing Red Stag this year everythig has changed as I had to move to be with my parents who due to age and the fact that dad has had several strokes were finding it difficult to manage the place now. However we will see what happens in the coming year as I still have the contact and I believe an invite to the SouthWest of Scotland to hunt the Reds Late September through Octiber is the time for Red Stag Stalking so who knows. Boy I wish I could pick up the S&B ammo at those prices I brought two boxes to try and they cost me $34:65 per box and that was educed as the dealer is a friend and let me have it at that price, this was the 8x57 196Grn SPCE loading. Oh and it seems that I have an invite to chase Elk in Colorado should I ever be able to make the trip. I have already made enquiries about the Hunter Ed requirements and hopfully will be sorting that out before to long just in case of course The 8x57 is in the frame should I make it. Yes it sure is a rush when the animals get that close, the last Fallow Deer I shot passed by me at about 6-8 feet but I couldn't move, I shot it a few minutes later at about 65 yards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ken98k Posted November 16, 2005 Report Share Posted November 16, 2005 I guess I'll chime in, even though the question seems answered. I live in Colorado and do a great deal of hunting and fishing. Of the 12 rifle elk hunters I know, there are 5 .270's, 2 7-08, 3 30-06's, a 300 win, and one 8 mag, I usually know when he has sighted it in, usually he has a nice shiner and a new pair of glasses, now its harder because he finally lightened up on magnification to get the proper clearence!!! the 3-9 leupold clearence is not enough! All of these hunters have taken a great number of elk, most with one shot. I mainly have hunted with the 270, 7-08 group. They would all have something to say about these rifles being too light for elk. I spotted a shot for my friend at a big cow last year at 400 yds with a 7-08, bullet hit in the center chest, she piled up in 10 yds, I've seen other kills with the lighter and heavier loads and see really no difference in killing ability. All of these hunter stress shot placement, and taking good percentage shots, with that I'm on my soapbox, shot placement is key, I'm tired of hearing about the guy with the cannon talking about his run-in with a bull and how he almost gotem, only to hear that he gut shot it, and gave up because he figured he was long gone (only to have a long drawn out death, count on that!) Or other close encounters that leave much to imagination of where or what those bullets hit! The country is pretty wide open in places, just because you see and can shoot at an elk at 500 yds or even 250 through cover does not mean you should. Sorry for the rant, I heard a couple of these stories a couple of days ago and realize that these hunters have traveled a long ways (some just from denver)and spent alot of money to hunt be that does not give you a free card when it comes to being an ethical hunter and taking ethical shots, okay, with that rant over. Okay the perfect elk rifle.............something over .277, accurate, accurate I mean being able to hit a pie plate at reasonable ranges, and most importantly and gun you feel comfortable shooting. I love my 270, but am planning a 338-06, varity is the spice of life 6390[/snapback] Beautifully said. Kenny in Alaska Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsefly Posted November 16, 2005 Author Report Share Posted November 16, 2005 Howdy Kenny,and welcome to our hangout! Youngtrout should be an outdoor writer,he has the touch to put his thoughts into words.Jerry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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