911rat Posted November 7, 2006 Report Share Posted November 7, 2006 I had a shortage of 35 Whelen cases and decided to form some out of once fired 30-06. I ran them through a 35 Whelen die without setting the shoulder back and the ones I've tried fit snug in the chamber. I did it that way to minimize stretch in the head area when they're fired. Should I have anealed them first? Any tips? I assume someone else does this too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AzRednek Posted November 7, 2006 Report Share Posted November 7, 2006 I had a shortage of 35 Whelen cases and decided to form some out of once fired 30-06. I ran them through a 35 Whelen die without setting the shoulder back and the ones I've tried fit snug in the chamber. I did it that way to minimize stretch in the head area when they're fired. Should I have anealed them first? Any tips? I assume someone else does this too. I've never annealed brass untill it has been fire formed. Can't say if doing it first is best. If you're splitting alot of necks on the upstoke try sneaking the necks over an 8MM expander ball before the 35. Might not be necessary with the newer dies that have tapered expanders. I did a couple of 30/06 to 35 Whelen just for kicks as I was loading the Whelen a couple days ago and came across a couple pieces of 06 brass. I'll get a picture up in a few minutes. My new wildcat 35 Acordian!! It fits in an 06 length mag but streches out to fit a H&H chamber!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Racepres Posted November 7, 2006 Report Share Posted November 7, 2006 My new wildcat 35 Acordian!! Love it!!! I have a few somewhat like it... [06, 223, 30 carb. 30-30... it goes on and on] I do alot of Wildcats. MV Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
911rat Posted November 7, 2006 Author Report Share Posted November 7, 2006 Well, I did 100, No necks split, they are a bit shorter than 35 Whelen brass but I suspect it makes no difference. If nothing split I'm thinking anealing isn't necesary. I used plenty of lube inside the neck applied with a q-tip. (Reminder; Tell the wife we're out of q-tips again) I actually tried running them over the expander in 8x57 dies first. They went through the Whelen dies easier than not running them through the 8mm but I felt it wasn't worth the extra step. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Racepres Posted November 7, 2006 Report Share Posted November 7, 2006 I seem to recall that annealing actually made the "acordian effect" worse for me. Perhaps I was going too far down the case, and softening the shoulder!! However, I have also found that annealing before making the cases by fireforming gives much better results... I just don't prefer fireforming! MV Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AzRednek Posted November 7, 2006 Report Share Posted November 7, 2006 About the only other tip I can offer for reforming brass is using STP for lube. Possibly some of the newer lubes are better. I read about using STP for case reforming somewhere in the 70's bought a tube of STP in a tube and still after 30 years still have plenty left. It worked better than the RCBS and Herters goo I had at the time. Most my reforming was 30/06 blanks to 7MM, 7.65. 7.7 and 8MM when the brass was not available without buying it as loaded ammo years ago. I've been told Hodgden's lube is simply re-packaged STP. I use white graphite for inside of necks and occasionaly stick a neck into the lube pad. I had to dig out my stuck case kit, first time in many years after getting a 300 Win case stuck last night. I was using Hornady's One-Shot, afterwards I went back to the pad loaded with STP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
911rat Posted November 7, 2006 Author Report Share Posted November 7, 2006 Well, according to my old NRA handloading book, it seems that the neck/shoulder should be annealed after die forming and before fireforming to extend case life. I've never annealed cases before. Any tips? I thought of using Tempilaq from Brownells to make sure I don't over heat the necks. AZ I've got a 223 case drilled and tapped just like that. I had some 308 brass get stuck in both a Redding and Lee sizing die last night. I used an ample amount of RCBS lube. I think the .308s were fired in a semi with a large chamber. I know a lot of guys that swear by Imperial Wax for sizing. Midway carries it and I think it's marketed by Redding now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AzRednek Posted November 7, 2006 Report Share Posted November 7, 2006 I've heard the Imperial Wax is the same as the wax electricians use to ease pulling romax through conduit. Can't think of name off hand. I can't say it with any first hand knowledge, something I heard in another group. Several posted in the thread claiming to use it. It is supposed to be available at Home Depot for a substantial amount less is cost. I've annealed brass by hitting it with a propane torch untill it changes color then dip it in water to cool. Afterwards I'd let it bake in the Arizona sun to get any moisture out of the inside. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
911rat Posted November 7, 2006 Author Report Share Posted November 7, 2006 I've heard the Imperial Wax is the same as the wax electricians use to ease pulling romax through conduit. Can't think of name off hand. I can't say it with any first hand knowledge, something I heard in another group. Several posted in the thread claiming to use it. It is supposed to be available at Home Depot for a substantial amount less is cost. I've annealed brass by hitting it with a propane torch untill it changes color then dip it in water to cool. Afterwards I'd let it bake in the Arizona sun to get any moisture out of the inside. Thanks AZ I'll check the Home Depot for that wax and give it a try. Also, thanks for sharing your annealing technique. I think you might be talking about Gardner Bender Wire-Aid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
donmarkey Posted November 8, 2006 Report Share Posted November 8, 2006 The only waxed based wire lube I know of is yellow 77. I get it by the 5 gal bucket, never tried it for reloading though. -Don Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rwims Posted November 8, 2006 Report Share Posted November 8, 2006 Try lubing your case with anhydrous lanolin. I've used for years as a reloading case lube and also used it to resize 7.65 Argie's out of 30-06. Best I've found. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AzRednek Posted November 8, 2006 Report Share Posted November 8, 2006 Try lubing your case with anhydrous lanolin. I've used for years as a reloading case lube and also used it to resize 7.65 Argie's out of 30-06. Best I've found. In the 50 and 60's lanolin based hair tonics were used for resizing and what an ol'timer told me it worked pretty good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CSANSO Posted November 8, 2006 Report Share Posted November 8, 2006 I don't form 35 whelen brass, but I do make 9.3x57 brass from 8mm. Which is about the same amount of increase from .308 to .358- .323 to.366. I bought the Hornady coustom dies in the caliber and was worried about this when I started making cases. I was told that it was not needed to make the cases but I feel that is could be useful in releaving some of the stress the brass goes through when making the conversion. I have done about 50 cases to 9.3 and have not lost a one in forning it to 9.3x57. I have lost more cases in resizing after being fired in the gun. This was due to lube that was gathering in the die and would on occasion dent in the shoulder area when it was passed through. Cleaning of the die and the proper amount of lube keeps this from happing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sailormilan2 Posted November 9, 2006 Report Share Posted November 9, 2006 I made several hundred 35 Whelens from FC 30-06 brass. I have the RCBS taper expander to go from 30 to 35. However, I did one thing differently. I used once fired, unsized brass to conver. I found that if I use already sized -06 brass I may have head space issues. So, I expand the neck, then full length size using a 35 Whelen sizing die. Doing it this way gives me a much better fit. One added advantage to doing it this way is that most case stretching occurs on the first firing. So, if you start with unsized, untrimmed, once fired brass, your final product will be a little longer. Unfortunately, it will still be short. I just measured about 6 of my converted brass, and it runs about .034" - .054" shorter than factory spec. As for the lube, I use standard Midway/Frankford Arsenal pump spray lube. Works just fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Downwindtracker2 Posted July 27, 2007 Report Share Posted July 27, 2007 I don't know about 35 Whelen,but I make 338-06 in one pass with a Lee set.They now have nice expander stem.One time reloading 30-06 I forgot to lube the inside of the neck,man that was work.I ussualy lube necks with the Lee white stuff and a bore mop.I wet the mop first.The mops use 8/32 threads. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gun nutty Posted July 27, 2007 Report Share Posted July 27, 2007 fireform with Bullseye and cream-of wheat. No special dies for that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
riflecrankdotcom Posted February 15, 2008 Report Share Posted February 15, 2008 I've never owned a factory .35 Whelen case, in the 10 years or so that I have had my Whelen. I formed my first batch of cases from milsurp .30/06 brass, and every batch since from .270 Winchester brass picked up at the range (I don't have a .270, but I have some .30/06s). I always anneal before AND after forming. I simply have a bucket of water handy, and pick up each case in turn by the head, and hold it in my hand while heating the neck area with a propane blowtorch. When it gets too hot to hold, I drop it in the bucket of water. The reason I started re-annealing after forming was, when necking down to make 7x57 brass from .270, I was losing a lot of brass to neck splits on the first firing. Once I started re-annealing to relieve stress, my success rate went way up. Since then, I always anneal twice when case-forming. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
911rat Posted February 16, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 16, 2008 Thanks for the tip riflecrank. seems to me that annealing cases can't ever hurt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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